[lug] LaTeX, margins, font size

[D. Stimits]

"J. Wayde Allen" wrote:
> 
> On Thu, 30 Aug 2001, D. Stimits wrote:
> 
> > I guess I'm just used to UNIX style man pages. It would be very pleasing
> > to see a man page for each tag format, e.g., "man documentclass" (even
> > though it could be just an html document and not really available by man
> > page commands). For example, a concise statement of what arguments are
> > available to \documentclass and \documenttype, along with an
> > explanation.
> 
> Well several of the URL's I've provided I thought had exactly this.  Let's
> see, maybe I can dig one of those up:
> 
> http://www.sci.usq.edu.au/staff/robertsa/LaTeX/latex2e.html
> http://www.sci.usq.edu.au/staff/robertsa/LaTeX/latex2e.html#SEC24
> http://www-h.eng.cam.ac.uk/help/tpl/textprocessing/teTeX/latex/latex2e-html/ltx-2.html
> http://www-h.eng.cam.ac.uk/help/tpl/textprocessing/teTeX/latex/latex2e-html/ltx-22.html

It looks like it, but it seems to be only a subset. Quite possibly that
is because I'm interested in an older version .tex file, thinking about
how it should be now. For example, no "documentstyle" is found. I would
guess I am floundering in version pains.

> 
> > But then I suppose it would be overwhelming to continue this with the
> > same sort of thing for all commands available from a given
> > documentclass.
> 
> No, that is exactly what is done in some of the URL's I've given
> you.  Also, there are not really a big selection of new commands for
> different document classes.  The document class mostly just describes the
> general look of the text, the default type, one or two column, paper,
> etc..

I see more of it is there than I thought. Another mistake I made was
thinking of the resume sample that is not distributed with the rest of
the relevant latex rpm's.

> 
> You might not be able to use a \Chapter command in a letter document
> class, but most people wouldn't need to do that.  Basically if you are
> writing articles or reports you break things up into \sections,
> \subsections, \subsubsections, etc., and the book class uses \chapter.  I
> think that is about the only differences in commands, and I'd have to run
> an experiment to be sure what if anything wouldn't work between classes.
> Mostly it just makes sense.
> 
> Basically, think of the document class as a very general style sheet.
> 
> > Basically I run into a need to look up the "function prototype" of
> > \documentclass, when converting from \documenttype, and can't
> > generally find specifics.
> 
> The URL's I've given do try to show the differences.  The books also tend
> to have a section on errata.
> 
> > class. I'm reminded of a Python book I have, which has not only an index
> > of Python commands and widgets, but also a picture of what each widget
> > does.
> 
> The LaTeX books do this too.  That is why we all keep suggesting that
> maybe you really need a book.

I do, but at this point I at least got my resume and cover letter done,
so anything else is just gravy on top. Of the two forms of gravy, one
would be color; for that I need to change the resume from documentstyle
to documentclass.

> 
> > This is in fact my really big reason for wanting some sort of gui for
> > this...not because I dislike hand editing (I'm a vi guy, I'm strangely
> > thrilled by knowing exactly what goes on when I configure something),
> > but because it offers a sort of prompting of everything that can be
> > done: Just select something and hit the button to see what it does.
> 
> OK, lets make this analogy.  This is somewhat akin to asking for a GUI
> interface to Python.  Sure such a thing has some value, the popularity of
> Visual Basic comes to mind, but you don't really want to be limited by the
> GUI.  Most experienced programmers also don't seem to care much for the GUI
> based languages.  You've kind of run into the same issue here.  LyX is to
> the the LaTeX world kind of like IDLE
> <http://www.python.org/idle/doc/idlemain.html> is to the Python world.

Yes, that is a better analogy. It would be fantastic to have a TeX/LaTeX
development environment. LyX is almost there, but not really. I don't
seem to be able to actually view the TeX/LaTeX without exporting (ok,
I'm just being over-picky, I want to see my code and processed views in
the same tool).

> 
> LaTeX and TeX are typesetting mark up languages.  They are modeled somewhat
> after the "mark up" that the editor would add to someone's text telling the
> typesetter how to stack the lead type into the printing press plates.  TeX
> computerized this mark up and LaTeX gives you an abstraction to a higher
> level.  Kind of like the difference between writing assembly code
> (TeX) versus C (LaTeX).

I am now hooked on LaTeX, after seeing how nice the resume looked. I
guess what I really need is to just sit down and try different
things...the experience of doing.

> 
> > There is also of course the need to visualize what has been done,
> > which is more convenient in a one-piece WYSIWYG editor, versus
> > multistage production to see each keystroke result, but it is the
> > ability to freeform design without exact knowledge that really makes
> > gui useful (thus it prompts to make further creation that might not
> > otherwise be possible, simply because of not knowing what is available
> > without a long, detailed reading).
> 
> Yes and no, again you have to realize that what you seem to want is a word
> processor.  If that is what you want, then by all means use one.  Just
> keep in mind that LaTeX isn't a word processor.  It is built around a very
> different paradigm.

I am convinced of the usefulness for LaTeX, but I still feel that there
are things that could be done to make working with it more intuitive.
Many of those things are derived from what could be done with a word
processor, but not because I want a word processor per se (I want the
exact printing that LaTeX is offering, and consistency in style). I'm
looking for a tool to aid the learning curve. LyX sort of does this, but
I haven't figured out how to switch between viewing processed view and
text view of actual TeX code (there is a TeX mode button, which I
haven't figured out...it doesn't seem to have anything to do with
changing the viewing mode between raw code and processed view).

> 
> > My LaTeX links are growing. The "holy grail" would have to be a set of
> > pages similar to man pages, listing all LaTeX commands for a given
> > document class, possibly with a "SEE ALSO" section for relevant older
> > document type syntax. Something that would allow a quick browsing of
> > features specific to particular styles/classes.
> 
> I've given you the best of the URL's that I've been able to find.  If
> nothing else, this discussion has significantly increase my personal list
> of LaTeX URL's.

It has been helpful to me too.

D. Stimits, stimits at idcomm.com

> 
> - Wayde
>   (wallen at lug.boulder.co.us)
> 
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