R e: [lug] Did Linus really not write Linux?

[Daniel Miller]

On Sat, 22 May 2004 15:18:12 -0600
Timothy Klein <teece at silverklein.net> wrote:

<snip>
> 
> Agenda Filter:  Isn't Andy Tannenbaum the author of Minix
> (the first competetion to Linux), 

Yes, Andrew Tannenbaum is the author of Minix.  No it wasn't
the first competition to Linux.  In fact Linus used Minix as
his first development platform for building Linux.  If you
read Linus's book "Just For Fun", its all detailed out.  

Competition is an interesting word and since I didn't get
involved with the Linux movement until 99 I can't say much
about the state of other Operating System kernels in the
early nineties.  

What I can say though is that based on what is written in
"Just For Fun" and the two articles written by Tannenbaum on
the John Brown Fiasco show that Minix was hardly considered
a competitor to Linux by either Linus or Tannenbaum.  If you
disagree with this read all the early posting to
comp.os.minix.  Tannenbaum was getting a lot of emails
asking him to make Minix into what Linux is today. 
Tannenbaum wasn't interested because he wrote Minix for a
different purpose.  A teaching tool if you can fathom that. 
>From his second online posting it doesn't sound like he
regrets the choice he made to let Linux invent the thing
that everyone wanted Minix to be.

and the same guy that had the lengthy Usenet 
> discussion with Torvalds in the early Nineties about how
> the Linux kernel was brain-dead, had no future, would
> never be ported to anything other than its original i386,
> and would never amount to anything, in general?
> 

You'll have to back this up with come newsgroup postings or
mailing list postings.  Its definitely possible that
Teannenbaum wrote those things, I just need some proof (Not
much of a believer in faith).

> If it's the same guy, he's an ass that is too full of
> himself.  He drowns out his good points out in
> know-it-all-ness.  He also was a wee bit wrong on his
> early assessments of Linux, and the direction of OS design
> in general.
> 

He is considered by many in the academic world to be one of
the foremost experts on OS design.  Can you really disregard
his expertise and philosophies based on a little debate that
he had with Linux over 10 years ago?  I'm not saying either
Linux or Tennenbaum are correct about kernel design, just
that it seems very ignorant to disregard someones thoughts
and call them an ass.  

The best part of your email is where you say Tennenbaum is a
"know-it-all-ness".  Wow, I have to say I've seen some very
know-it-all comments come from Linus.  In fact, I personally
think I've seen a lot more arrogance out of Linus then I
have anyone else in the Unix/Linux/BSD community.  Even more
then Eric Raymond and Theo De Raddt combined.

I don't own "Just For Fun", but in the book Linux mentions
that he went to some convention or meeting (I can't remember
which).  At the meeting everyone stood up and gave him a
standing ovation.  When they started to quiet down, Linus
said "I am your GOD" or "I am God".  Something along those
lines.  Now if that isn't arrogant and know-it-all like, I
don't know what is.  To Linus's credit in the book he says
that he regrets saying that and it was a mistake. 

You really should read the book as most of the things I've
said in this email come from it.  Also please realize that
the things I state from the book are completely from memory
as I don't actually own a copy and read the book over a year
ago.

> That doesn't discount his argument, but then again, why
> bother?
> 
> Tim

Because We (The Linux Community) must not forget where and
why Linux was started.  That includes giving credit to
Andrew Tennenbaum for the little part he played in the
creation of Linux.

I must confess I am a bull headed person.  Usually when
someone tells me I can't do something or that an idea of
mine will not work, I increase my effort two fold.  It gives
me all the extra incentive I need to prove them wrong.  If
Linus has anything in common with me then maybe Tennenbaum
did more for the birth of Linux then we realize.  Just by
disagreeing with Linus in such a public and upfront way
Linus had all the more incentive to publish Linux and prove
Tennenbaum wrong.  Given the state of Linux today I would
say Linus has done a good job of doing just that.

Daniel Miller

P.S. Don't worry I haven't forgotten who are fearless kernel
creator is.  I still pay him respect.  I am not a Linus
playa hater.

P.S.S I was too lazy to go look up how Tennenbaum is spelled
if you didn't notice.